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New Sorcery 101 and Update (aka how I was fired for Christmas)
 dannysdomain - (kellhound1365)
 
08:38pm 17/12/2009
 
 
kellhound1365 posting in Sorcery 101 Community
New Sorcery 101 is up

And here is an update on all things that affect this comic.

Firstly, I've found an apartment. I'm moving in right after the holidays.

Secondly, not only am I moving but Sorcery 101 and all the other Veiled Truths comics will be moving to different hosting. So if the site is glitchy at any point until the end of January it's because both sites are moving off Keenspot. Why? Well, because Keenspot fired me. I got the email two days ago. Why did they fire me? I asked that question as well and got the response "We have multiple reasons." None of which they will tell me. It happened right after Scott Kurtz's ustream where I talked said Keenspot was only good for the newsboxes (which is true and I'm not the only person on Keenspot who's said that) and I'd leave once the newsboxes stopped being useful. Because they are EXTREMELY unprofessional.

And before now I've never gone into specifics, but since I'm fired here's stuff people who were thinking of joining Keenspot should know.

- They lost my books the first day of San Diego Comic Con last year because they just forgot which box they were in. Fortunately, they were found the second day and I still sold out. But fact remains for a little while they lost 100 books.

- I hope you enjoyed those iPhone apps because they are getting taken down a few days from now. I never got a sales report on them, never mind paid for them in any way.

- I have talked to several Keenspot artists (not naming names so folks don't get in trouble) and found they have never gotten paid on time for their books.

- After the original excitement over iphone apps was over, Keenspot basically forgot they existed. They have been sitting on Sorcery 101 chapter 3 since before August. But I guess it's good it didn't go up since I wouldn't have gotten paid for that anyways. (All of the above are why I'm printing Sorcery 101 books myself and not letting Keenspot print them.)

- There is almost always a thread is the private forum for Keenspot creators which is asking "So when am I getting paid?"

- It could be days before tech problems are addressed. Ex: From Scratch is still not on Keenspot's front page and the comic drop down hasn't been updated in a year or so.

-Keenspots booth at Comic con was a disaster as far as planning went. They had banners advertising artists who weren't attending and none of those had Keenspots logo on it. People didn't even know what we were for. Someone asked an artist behind the Keenspot booth, "do guys know where the keenspot booth it?"

- Someone with access with Keenspot's official twitter used it to fight with Scott Kurtz making everyone involved with Keenspot look bad. Then it was used to lash out at a Keenspotter who used his personal twitter to tell them it's not cool to do that.

- The newsbox and Keenspot ads frequently get "stuck" on comics by the CEO's brother.

But Kurtz helped me find some good hosting because Sorcery 101 is too big for all the usual places people use starting out like dreamhost. And some keenspotters, Kris Straub, and a ton more people are all offering help with website stuff. But there may be bumps.

So pass this livejournal post to any keenspot comics you read or anyone to considering applying to Keenspot. So they know what's up. And if Sorcery 101 goes down or I lose my domain names I'll leave it to you guys to guess why.

As of this morning Keenspot has privately told me why.

Also, keep pledging to Kickstarter.
 
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(no subject)
 bobbycrosby
 
01:18am 19/12/2009 (UTC)
 
 
Bobby Crosby
Almost everything that Kell, Kurtz and Straub said were lies, and Kurtz almost certainly wrote most of what Kell said for her. And when they're not lying, they're insinuating other lies, like that Keenspot would conceivably take down her site out of spite, when they've never once done that to the dozens of other Keenspot members who were fired or left, most of which left under far worse terms than this situation.

The lie about how my comics get more newsbox times than others is really disgusting, since they almost certainly get the least, and Kell's get three times as many, as pointed out earlier. "+EV" hasn't had one since August.

I don't understand how someone can post so many lies, have them PROVEN WRONG, and then still have people supporting them. It makes no sense to me. Kell says things like "They had banners advertising artists who weren't attending and none of those had Keenspots logo on it," then Keenspot shows that all the banners were advertising artists who WERE IN ATTENDANCE, who she SPENT A WEEK SITTING NEXT TO, and they show an image of the banners which clearly shows the Keenspot logo twice, and no one even posts an "lol" in response? I thought it was pretty funny and is yet another thing that shows how paranoid and out of touch Kell is with the world around her -- possibly even more than me. She apparently even asked "numerous times" about if her site would be taken down before she can move it, and was of course assured that it wouldn't, and then she decided to insinuate publicly that Keenspot is of course going to take down her site because they're such assholes. It's disgusting.

"Even with these rebuttals withstanding, there is a reason why Keenspot gets such a bad rap . . ."

Yes, even with how Keenspot just called out Kell on all her public lies in a way too nice manner, there is a reason why they get such a bad rap, and that reason is you and your buddy telling non stop lies about Keenspot to everyone who makes comics, and you guys have been doing this for many years. You can't stop yourselves. I can't imagine you even know why you're doing it anymore. Just something to do on a Friday night, I guess.

"iPhone app payouts, revenue calculations, etc: when people ask, do you say there are delays, or do you just ignore them?"

I'm told that Kell asked only once about her iPhone stats and she was told everything that was known about them at the time.

CONTINUED . . .
 
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(no subject)
 bobbycrosby
 
01:18am 19/12/2009 (UTC)
 
 
Bobby Crosby
"Hire an accountant!! That is an absurd way to run a business that makes as much money as Keenspot is purported to."

Where in the world did you hear that Keenspot makes a lot of money? The whole insane argument from Kurtz and Straub seems to be that KEENSPOT = WAL-MART -- no, worse than that. Your argument is that Keenspot is a sweat shop, making money off of KIDS, even though the average age of a Keenspot member is over 30. Why would a company that makes pennies hire an accountant??? The whole point of Keenspot is apparently to simply be extremely nice to people who make comics and try to help them make money off their work. I've been calling for Keenspot to shut down for many years because of this, because it's a ton of work to make practically nothing and its only purpose is helping people who are "at best unenthusiastic, and at worst miserable," mostly because of lies spread by Kurtz and Straub. The reason people on Keenspot are unenthusiastic and miserable is because they're CONSTANTLY being told by people that they for some reason respect that they're a member of a horrible company and that they're almost certainly being stolen from, and don't forget the fact that they're also being told that they're little children when in fact they're 45 years old (for example).

"You can't make payments to your creators on time because you're short-handed? That is still your problem."

Did you miss the part where Keenspot has always paid advances to anyone who asks for one, even those who are losing money and often have no hope of ever making money? Did you miss the part where Keenspot graciously printed 100 copies of a promotional book for Kell and gave her booth space at the biggest convention in the world for free and then she publicly tells everyone that Keenspot is only good for its newsbox??? It's flat out disgusting, bordering on evil/heartless.

"Would this restructuring and its delays be a continuation of the restructuring and delays that spurred six of us to leave in 2005? Or is this a new restructuring?"

What the flying fuck. Were iPhone apps around in 2005, Straub? Because you were quoting from this sentence: "We've been in the process of completely restructuring the way we do things with regards to iPhone apps." The lengths you guys go to in order to spread lies about Keenspot are just retarded. You assume that everyone who reads these posts are complete and total morons, knowing you can fool them with lies, so you find as many ways as possible to lie to them, and for what purpose? To take down a company you're in competition with, I guess, but ugh, it's disgusting that the world of webcomics has people like that in them, people motivated simply by greed over pennies, or at best revenge for who knows what.

CONTINUED . . .
 
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(no subject)
 bobbycrosby
 
01:19am 19/12/2009 (UTC)
 
 
Bobby Crosby
"It was a Blatant Comics showcase, with Keenspot's creators pushed off to either side."

This makes no sense. The booth is half Keenspot, half Blatant. Look in your SDCC guide -- it has both names, two separate 10x10 booths. I was the one off to the side, while everyone else took up the vast majority of the booth obviously. If your whole point is that Blatant = me, then how do you imagine that I took up the majority of the booth? I'm less than half the size of Kurtz and my brother, and there were a ton of people in that booth. If you're only talking about the backdrop, the three Blatant standees as opposed to two Keenspot standees, then what's your problem? Again, Blatant is half the booth, so you'd expect half of the backdrop to be Blatant obviously, and then all of my comics are also on Keenspot, so it also makes sense for one of my comics to spill over onto the Keenspot side, as opposed to the other way around, having a Keenspot standee spill over onto the Blatant side. Also, the only reason it makes sense to have a booth, business wise, is to catch the attention of producers walking by, and obviously my comics have the best chance at that. The only reason to have a Keenspot booth at all is to simply do yet another really nice thing for members of Keenspot and let them have free booth space at the biggest convention there is. It's completely insane that you guys are somehow complaining about it and saying that someone shouldn't be on Keenspot because the Keenspot booth might have 20% of its backdrop covered up by half of a Blatant Comics standee.

"To have a booth presence mismanaged year after year, as Keenspot's frequently is, is unacceptable this far down the road."

Why??? Who cares??? What does it matter to you? Keenspot is a tiny company that shouldn't even have a booth at SDCC in the first place but does so anyway mostly just as a little bonus to its members, a little gift. Are you the same type of person who turns down a free gift because it's not nice enough for someone of your stature??? Who gives a fuck???

"You reserve the right to run a DREAMLESS newsbox for 18 days out of the month, so be it."

"Dreamless" has had five newsboxes this year for a total of five days.

"We all know you guys have Keenspot on autopilot and are basically using it to fund Chris and Bobby's side projects."

It's the OPPOSITE. Our projects keep Keenspot alive so even more time and money can be wasted on it because its owners for some reason love a bunch of people who mostly hate them because of your lies.

No one in my family lives in a school.

"I just needed you to say publicly my site would be fine so that it wouldn't become a he said she said issue. Hope you understand that."

#1 -- That makes no sense. #2 -- Why aren't you apologizing for all the lies you publicly just told about Keenspot and were called out on??? I don't understand how you can just act like they didn't happen.
 
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(no subject)
 bobbycrosby
 
01:32am 19/12/2009 (UTC)
 
 
Bobby Crosby
Also, the first time I ever entered a Keenspot booth was 2008. That was also the first time since 1995, I think, that any of my comics were sold/promoted at the San Diego Comic-Con. So stop acting like Keenspot's sole purpose has always been to promote my stuff.
 
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(no subject)
 (Anonymous)
 
01:51am 19/12/2009 (UTC)
 
 
What on earth is wrong with you, seriously? You are incredibly unprofessional and everything is falling down around you, and you think the best way to handle it is a three post moan in here?

Methinks the Crosby doth protest too much.
 
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(no subject)
 (Anonymous)
 
04:35pm 19/12/2009 (UTC)
 
 
Hey Bobby, your reply really does not come across well, the mixture of insults and protests make it kind of hard to picture you as the victim here so don't be surprised if you end up lacking sympathy in the end.
What you should do is take a look at what Kel says, not just read and shout out "LIES!" but actually read it because maybe, just maybe this is how things seem to your own staff so instead of shouting off accusations it might be an idea to take this criticism and try to make something productive out of it.
 
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Rebuttal to your points
 toonhound
 
08:41am 20/12/2009 (UTC)
 
 
Bobby, not sure you're a very rational person these days. But I thought I would respond to your rantings a bit.

1) I didn't write anything Kel wrote. She's capable to writing her own thoughts and words. Nor did I put her up to anything. You act as if I orchestrated this. Your brother and Mother did. I only reacted. Which, I think, is fair.

2) I rarely visit keenspot. Most of the time it's to visit Gunshow. But on the odd occasions that I do visit, I'm always the newsbox populated by products owned by either you or your brother. If your projects don't get more newsbox time, it sure appears that way.

3) Let's go over the banners in that picture, real fast:
Dreamless - your project
marry me - Chris' project
Last Blood - your project
No Pink Ponies - Chris' partner's project
First Daughter - Chris' property.

Blatant and Keenspot are these very disparate entities when it suits you and sister companies when it suits you. You own both companies. You took the Keenspot booth this year and gave half to Blatant. We were all there and we all saw it. You were a big loudmouth in that booth. The keenspot guys were shoved into the corner. Don't tell us we didn't see what we saw.

4) It's not surprising that Kel worried that her site would be dumped without warning. She was asked to leave without warning and without reason. And when she did get a hint of why she was cut loose part of it was because she had badmouthed the company (which is something that's only okay to do if you're Bobby Crosby). Why would you expect her to think that you guys would act in any reasonable manner moving forward?

5) Kel shouldn't have to ask you to keep her updated on her iphone app status. That's your companies job. Not only that, but Teri is incorrect in claiming Apple pays out quarterly for app sales. They pay out every month your app makes over $250. And payment for said month comes 45 days after the month ends. It's not quarterly. So who's lying now?

6) We heard that Keenspot makes a lot of money from your brother. The crazy fucker can't stop blabbing about how much money your company makes. Here's just one example:

"I’ve posted WOWIO revenue numbers publicly before for my companies (Blatant Comics/Keenspot), so I have no problem with giving an update on that. Since last August we’ve made $93,624.50 from 186,736 WOWIO downloads. "

7) Nothing Kel has said about Keenspot has come close to the damage you've done to both your company's and family's reputation. Admittedly on purpose. So what does it matter. Comparatively to both your and Chris' public behavior, Kel's been really tame.

8) Used to be that Keenspot had a whole endcap. Now they have half of it. Because you got the other half. So they lost out on space and they gained a shitty neighbor. And during the con, you fired one member. So they lost members of their ranks DURING the show. Why would they be happy about that?
 
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Re: Rebuttal to your points
 bobbycrosby
 
03:24am 21/12/2009 (UTC)
 
 
Bobby Crosby
Why would I care who's happy?

Since when did Eisu become Chris's partner? What???

How does WOWIO have anything to do with Keenspot? Blatant Comics had the WOWIO account, not Keenspot. You get confused very easily.

How could my comics appear to get the most newsbox time when they in fact get the least? This is 100% obviously a lie orchestrated by you guys, perpetuating a myth.

"You took the Keenspot booth this year and gave half to Blatant."

It was the exact same set up in 2008. Why did no one complain about that at the time? And why is anyone complaining about it now? What's your possible problem with that?

"You were a big loudmouth in that booth."

LOL, wow. I try to talk to as few people as possible for as little time as possible. I despise talking to people. I'm the opposite of a loudmouth in public.

"The keenspot guys were shoved into the corner. Don't tell us we didn't see what we saw."

Once again, that's impossible. HOW COULD THEY? Explain the logic of that. I'm ONE PERSON while they had every bit of the booth that I wasn't in. There was hardly room for anyone to move -- how could they conceivably be shoved into a corner??? Obviously I was the one in the corner. Ask anyone who was there who isn't a crazy giant liar like you and Kell and Straub.

"She was asked to leave without warning and without reason."

Without reason, LOL. That's like shooting someone in the leg and then they punch you in the face without saying "I'm punching you because you shot me" and saying it's without reason.

"And during the con, you fired one member."

No one was fired during the 2009 SDCC. Stop lying.
 
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Re: Rebuttal to your points
 bobbycrosby
 
03:52am 21/12/2009 (UTC)
 
 
Bobby Crosby
Oh, wait, was Troutman fired during the 2009 SDCC? He might have been. I always think of it as him being fired during the 2008 SDCC, because that's when he did all the disgusting shit in the booth (drinking alcohol and showing it to the webcam even, among many other horrible things), and that's when I said he had to be fired, but Chris might have waited a year. I seem to recall now that he wouldn't stop entering the booth in 2009, even though he was told after '08 that he could never be in the booth again, and I kept telling him to leave and he made a big scene about it for a while, kept repeating how he's a member of Keenspot so he has a right to be in the booth, even though he's a sickening piece of shit who's 50 times more unprofessional than I'll ever be.
 
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Re: Rebuttal to your points
 aquadulcis
 
12:13pm 04/01/2010 (UTC)
 
 
aquadulcis
Why is drinking alcohol a horrible thing? He's an adult isn't he?
 
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Re: Rebuttal to your points
 mercurian
 
05:12pm 23/01/2010 (UTC)
 
 
I don't think it's possible for *anyone* to be less professional than you. If you were anyone else, you'd have been fired by now.
 
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Re: Rebuttal to your points
 bobbycrosby
 
03:25am 21/12/2009 (UTC)
 
 
Bobby Crosby
Wait, you also said "Marry Me" was Chris's project? You've got some real problems.
 
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I hope something is done about Bobby's badmouthing
 (Anonymous)
 
01:38am 19/12/2009 (UTC)
 
 
I think its pretty obvious here that Bobby Crosby is not interested in being part of Keenspot. I really hope that the owners of Keenspot, in keeping with their past actions, let him go. He obviously has little to no interest in being a member of Keenspot and is just using them for their newsboxes.

I mean, he calls for Keenspot to be shut down numerous times! This is clearly a man that is just trying to get Keenspot to fail so that more money can be wasted on his personal projects.
 
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(no subject)
 capri_chan
 
05:13am 19/12/2009 (UTC)
 
 
Denise: Liquid Snake
Thank you, you've reminded me of why I just read your comics and ignore the comments completely.

Incidentally, since I have the chance to ask, why does Marry Me have a banner that says it updates every Friday? I don't mind sporadic updates. I follow other comics with no reliable update schedule. But I'd appreciate it if you actually said this, because it's kind of annoying to be lied to
picword: Liquid Snake
 
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(no subject)
 ghede
 
02:48am 24/12/2009 (UTC)
 
 
~: T h e  :  M a d m a n :~
Are you 12?
 
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(no subject)
 (Anonymous)
 
01:26pm 23/12/2009 (UTC)
 
 
Well. I guess I can say I'll no longer be reading any comics by Bobby Crosby. Dreamless is beautiful, but we know that's mostly because of Sarah Ellerton's artwork, not for his writting. Even in the comments for his own webcomic he sounds like a jerk. Great job counter-advertising.
 
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Lets not forget to part out the sexism..
 (Anonymous)
 
01:50am 19/12/2009 (UTC)
 
 
Seriously, in only a misogynists paranoid fantasy world is saying "Kurtz almost certainly wrote most of what Kell said for her." You literally cannot fathom a woman having an opinion.

I hope your mom comes and grounds you from the internet soon, because you're really making your company look horrible.
 
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Re: Lets not forget to part out the sexism..
 bobbycrosby
 
02:01am 19/12/2009 (UTC)
 
 
Bobby Crosby
LOL, wow, how did this possibly become an argument about sexism?

"You literally cannot fathom a woman having an opinion."

All she did was say proven lies. It's a compliment to her to say that Kurtz wrote it.
 
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Re: Lets not forget to part out the sexism..
 (Anonymous)
 
01:31pm 19/12/2009 (UTC)
 
 
What are Chris and Teri doing while you're running all over the neighborhood without your leash on? A responsible company and a responsible family would have hired someone to wrangle you by now. But here you are out in the wild. Are you even wearing your helmet? Do they even know you're posting here?
 
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